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Wizards Leaked OGL
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shadeun
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:03 am

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:WotC are just trying to hem in the Woke generation and prevent them from looking outside their walled garden. That generation are too far gone and too dumb to live in a free economy anyways, and if you speak to them they don’t want to live in a free society, so who are we to stop them? WotC are just moving to stake out their territory in the new economic landscape is all.

The older generation are even dumber though. Tilting at windmills about the free economy when they grew up in the most subsidised economy in history - on the back of an economic boom driven by outsourcing to the very communist countries they rail against.

So the only void in the market is the manufacturing of actual boxes for existing authored products.

This may well result in small press companies restructuring, rebranding, dissolving, but I suspect that those who already write and publish do not do it for the money, and do not set out with any expectation of financial compensation at the outset for their works. That being the case, I suspect these products will still appear, and the world of OSR will continue on a different remittance structure (Patrean/BuymeaCoffee/Whatever).

I kind of agree with you re: the rest of your point though. Theres plenty of free RPG shit out there, theres 0 reason to buy all this 3rd party stuff.

In a world where Apple, Google & Facebook get away with literal monopolies and the FTC and UK/other compatriots do nothing..... why shouldn't WoTC say they should get a cut of stuff linked to their system ... (and their new system they are investing in - though lets be honest it'll be shit).

3rd party creators living off the back of the IP of a company like Hasbro should know better than to trust them. You'd only have to play MTG and see whats happened there to think that the monetization train was never going to stop.

mbassoc2003
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:31 am

My point was that 3rd Party content creators do not need WotC.
They can continue to publish whatever they wish and seek funding via other avenues.

Leave the woke lot to their walled garden safe space, and let WotC dress their greed up in their touted inclusivity cloak, plant their pretty virtue signal flag atop the new rainbow branding. WotC are targetting a very specific player type. Its a good move on their part if they can pull it off. I'd be even more impressed if they could convince all these awakenned players that they don't need to buy andy books in the future, all they need to do is pay a subscription to WotC via an app on their device to have the right to read and be included within the big Dungeons & Dragons club.

...

Meanwhile the rest of the world will move on, and the grown-ups will continue to publish content. Those who wish more and better content will gift money to those they see as having talent. Competition is needed and it will seperate the good from the alsorans. The latter will make do with offering their product for free, and let's face it, they were doing it for the love of what they were doing anyways. Surely they weren't stupid enough to think they'd earn and income from writing RPG stuff? And, every now and then we'll see one or other author jump the wall for the promise of more money or better publicity, which would be no different that Simon and Basil selling their fantasy world to Games Workshop, of any of the 3rd party publishers who were bought out by TSR.

This week I've been mostly eating . . . The white ones with the little red flecks in them.

avenplainstrider
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 5:33 pm

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:WotC are just trying to hem in the Woke generation and prevent them from looking outside their walled garden. That generation are too far gone and too dumb to live in a free economy anyways, and if you speak to them they don’t want to live in a free society, so who are we to stop them? WotC are just moving to stake out their territory in the new economic landscape is all.

As a person of this "Woke Generation", we hate this too. No-one likes this honestly. The "walled garden" is really just due to the issue that D&D is now one of the most easily accessible RPGs on the market. You would not believe how hard it is today to get players that have only played 5e to play another system, so for as much content there is, there just isn't the same amount of accessibility.

As for economics, the older generation is definitely not helping considering we are approaching Rockafeller-esque monopoly men while the older generation starts to back people who just keep pushing big business more and more, leading to more issues such as this.

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:Leave the woke lot to their walled garden safe space, and let WotC dress their greed up in their touted inclusivity cloak, plant their pretty virtue signal flag atop the new rainbow branding. WotC are targetting a very specific player type. Its a good move on their part if they can pull it off. I'd be even more impressed if they could convince all these awakenned players that they don't need to buy andy books in the future, all they need to do is pay a subscription to WotC via an app on their device to have the right to read and be included within the big Dungeons & Dragons club.

Also, people have been paying for online content?
Half of the DM's of my generation have been using 5e.tools due to the fact we don't want to give WotC half our paychecks, especially due to the fact that D&D Beyond seemed like a trap from the start.
"Oh you wanna use this stuff online with our character creator? Pay up. Yes, we know you bought the books. Pay up."
Sounded like a scheme made by a business who didn't care too much for it's audience from the start.

for_the_love_of_the_stuff
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 8:30 pm

@mbassoc Show us on the doll where the WoKe GeNeRaTiOn touched you.

ExTSR
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Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:52 pm

OGL gaming controversy

In 2012 we launched Eldritch Enterprises. We decided to NOT use the OGL -- because it gave away our rights.

I have not changed my opinion.

When some publishers gave away their rights to gain a small profit, they built on sand. I ache for those whose careers are now being washed out by a high tide of corporate lawyers, but that's business in America.

Reject the paid-subscription model... it's bait on a hook, dummy.

You can play whatever you want without spending more (and you can always buy more dice).

Good luck out there as Hasbro reshapes the landscape of the business. Buy third-party things (those NOT Wizards-branded, duh) and support the creativity that is so widespread.

(reposted from FB)

My friends Dave & Gary made a quantum leap in entertainment. Remember them.

mbassoc2003
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Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:03 am

The funny thing is, one day a generation will wake up and realise that the game is something that can happen inside their head, and that maybe spending half their lives paying WotC for the right to think, for the rules about what they must and must not think about, and under the condition that if you think of something and write it down and publish it, you instantly give the IP to WotC, was a really dumb thing to buy into. And yes, they buy into this whole walled garden thing with real money and real effort. Some very talented and very dumb people choose to build WotC up with their own labour for the scraps that WotC are right now trying to take away from them.

One day they will be paying a monthly subscription to access a walled garden safe space, where there won't be any 'dangerous content' or 'wrong think', and they will no longer even have the right to own a physical product. They will own nothing, but at least they will be happy.

Imagine if we ever needed to rely on the youth of today to defend our nations.

for_the_love_of_the_stuff wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:@mbassoc Show us on the doll where the WoKe GeNeRaTiOn touched you.

This week I've been mostly eating . . . The white ones with the little red flecks in them.

Deadlord
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Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 1:38 pm

Roleplaying games have devolved from imagination-based to script-based in order to cater to the latest generations, whose ability to think and imagine has atrophied. It has lost the original core concept.

If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.

Deadlord
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Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 1:43 pm

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:Imagine if we ever needed to rely on the youth of today to defend our nations.

I shudder to even think of it. They as a generation have no concept of what actual combat is like, thanks to media and entertainment glamorizing it. They are certainly capable of mowing down hundreds of virtual enemies with infinite ammo in Call of Duty, but as far as real life I have zero faith that they would even be able to handle it physically, let alone mentally.

If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.

sauromatian
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Posted: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:14 pm

Deadlord wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:mowing down hundreds of virtual enemies

For everyone who doesn't think government has the solution, consider that Congress is now acting to solve our Taylor Swift problems. For instance, if she doesn't agree to have my baby soon, all of the time I've spent stalking her residence will go to waste! A fix for the OGL cannot be far behind.

Deadlord
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 5:02 pm

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:The funny thing is, one day a generation will wake up and realise that the game is something that can happen inside their head

Funny you say that. My 11 year old and I have a campaign that started as pen and paper (his 1st character) and has transitioned to us playing pretty much exclusively in our heads. He's 7th level, and his paper still has 3rd level info. Car rides are where most of the gaming takes place. Granted, it is not super easy for me to keep track of things like magic items and equipment, six NPCs etc., but I handle that by limiting the number of items he finds, and leverage the fact that he forgets things. The only thing that is not mental is dice rolling; initially we used my old trick of me picking a number in my head and him picking one, then me adding mine to his for the result. However, I usually let him use a website on his phone for the rolling now. Since this is his first character, if he is in a situation where I might want/need to fudge dice rolls, I let him use the website but tell him I am going to add a number to his roll.
As far as developing his imagination, this method is actually MUCH better, since he cannot write anything down and has to memorize it after visualizing it. He enjoys it so much he raves to the kids in school about it.

If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.

Muad'dib Pendragon
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 6:04 pm

OGL 1.0a & Creative Commons

WotC pulled a complete 180. The survey numbers could NOT be more clear...

sauromatian
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Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:00 pm

Muad'dib Pendragon wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:WotC pulled a complete 180

Now it's time to tally up the predictions to see who was right. Everyone who said WotC would stick to their guns, deduct 150 XP from your current total, or add 150 if you predicted they would cave.

for_the_love_of_the_stuff
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 9:06 am

sauromatian wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:
Now it's time to tally up the predictions to see who was right. Everyone who said WotC would stick to their guns, deduct 150 XP from your current total, or add 150 if you predicted they would cave.

I blame the WoKe GeNeRaTiOn...

mbassoc2003
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Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2023 12:52 pm

for_the_love_of_the_stuff wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:I blame the WoKe GeNeRaTiOn...

Nope. It was pure greed, an accurate prediction by WotC of where their financial future is heading, and a bunch of liberals wanting to pander to the woke with a load of BS PR. None of the decision makers give a flying F about anything other than their own jobs, and the future revenue of the company. There was no ethics involved here. All the fluff and flowery language were just that. Soft spacing so as not to offend the overly sensetive and self triggered harlequins. Bottom line, it was a mony play. They over-reached, but they demonstrated they are willing to flex their muscle and will do so again. Foreshadowing as it were of where the game (and its lisence) is headed. It affects no-one other than those who do not use their brains to play the game. It never did. They just don't want to push too hard in case people wake up and realise they can walk away from WotC and still play, write and share D&D content (and still get paid for it).

This week I've been mostly eating . . . The white ones with the little red flecks in them.

ashmire13
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:20 am

Does that mean I could print all of Daves home written adventures and world he created but never played with anyone, and release it without being sued by the owners of Dungeons and Dragons ? I guess from what he owned, it was all the early books anyway.

I ask, because there is a lot of it that he wrote himself and I felt it could go to use somehow? I don’t know.

Rolls a '3'

"Did I hit.....?"

sauromatian
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 6:53 am

ashmire13 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL: he created but never played with anyone

An interesting idea, but how do you know he never played it with anyone? Finding out for certain could be difficult - a real Columbo-episode head scratcher.

ashmire13
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 8:25 am

That is true, I am only assuming from our time together.

Rolls a '3'

"Did I hit.....?"

Deadlord
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Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2023 4:54 pm

mbassoc2003 wrote in Wizards Leaked OGL:Bottom line, it was a mony play.

Therein lies the trap so many companies fall into. They try to grab too much, and even if they drop the ploy, they now have a reputation for having done so, and will be suspected of doing so again in the future.

If you hit a Rowsdower, you get to keep it.

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